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 Post subject: by-planes rigging
PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2005 2:55 pm 
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FG Origami Master

Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2004 1:49 pm
Posts: 178
Location: tucson
I like to make bi and tri planes. but I have so much trouble geting the struts and wire supports in. I've used foam rubber and bulsa wood to separate wings but they still come out so-so. But the wire supports are awful. I use heavy sowing thread. I.ve used a needle and i've gluded one end and tried but they still don't look tight enough. :roll:

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 26, 2005 11:37 am 
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FG Cutter
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Joined: Tue Sep 14, 2004 9:11 pm
Posts: 65
Location: Edmonton, Canada
.Hey Cowboy,

Bi-planes are tricky but worth the effort in my opinion. I'm really not too good at this either, though I have built about 8.

There is a wonderful site on Stick and Tissue airplanes http://www.ffscale.co.uk/index.htm that has a tutorial on attatching bi-plane wings http://www.ffscale.co.uk/page4b.htm that may help a bit. I've honsetly never gone to the trouble of jiging the wings up myself, but perhaps I should have if my tri-plame is any indications of my talent. :oops:

The FG model I did rig was a Bullet monoplane Image I used SILK silver thread. This is the only way to go. Cotton thread fuzzies and collects dust. The silk is expensive, but you will only need a tenth of a spool for your lifetime so sell some to your friends :) I pulled the tread through tiny holes I drilled into the paper (simply pulling the neadle through tugs and pulls too much) and put tiny drops of glue at the ends. This model was easy 'cause the thread could go through the wing. Not sure how you would do it when the thread goes through only one surface which is normal.

On a solid model I carved, I used very small music wire. Not sure about the results as it looks too heavy, but they are straight and tight...Image

Anybody out there have some more hints here? I suspect that there are many of us who could do with a tutorial.

Take care,

.Kenny


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jun 26, 2005 3:39 pm 
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Paper Model CINC
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Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:34 am
Posts: 955
Location: Pensacola
If your know any model ship builders, talk to them. They're thoroughly used to weaving lots of thread between very small parts. They u8se cotton thread--but they coat it with beeswax. They run it through tiny holes (like #76 drill bit sized). They have lots of homemade tools, mainly made from thinn dowel stock and wire or needles. Find a book on model ship building and rigging at your local hoby shop or do a goole search on line. You'll see lots of techniques that you can use.

How do I know this? Built a few ships in my past, and still have one "under construction".

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jun 26, 2005 9:49 pm 
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Site Admin

Joined: Tue Sep 14, 2004 5:01 pm
Posts: 779
Location: Phoenix
.I tend to cheat. I poke holes in the wings before cutting them out, then fold and attach the wing(s). After everything dries I thread the rigging trying to use one piece of thread. I then tie it off. putting some tension, so the wings bend out of shape. Then I work the string until the knot is somewhere inconspicuous(ousousousous). Then I straighten the wings. If everything works out, there is now enough tension to hold the wings straight.


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 Post subject: Beading thread
PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2005 4:31 pm 
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FG Origami Master

Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2005 4:11 pm
Posts: 182
Location: Marion County, Texas
I like to black nylon or silk beading thread or "invisible thread" (very fine nylon monofilament from the sewing department --- paint black or silver). I use a fine beading needle to handle the thread and run it thru pre-punched holes. Either nylon or silk thread should be run over a piece of bee's wax or "Thread Heaven" to "defuzz" it. Beading thread and needles will be found with the seed beads in a craft store.

Start by working out a "rigging route" to use the least possible number of threads to do the job. Run the thread through the first hole and anchor it with a SMALL drop of gap-filling super glue (hobby shop or maybe the model section in a craft store). After the glue sets (a few seconds [or less if you apply a drop of accellerator] run the tread through the next 2 holes, tighten it and put a drop of glue on the first of these two holes. Continue this way until you reach the end of your run and glue the last holes. After the glue sets, crefully trim off any "whiskers" that are left.

Tip: put a small amount of glue in a coffee can lid, or bottle cap or something of the sort, and put the super glue bottle in the refrigerator for storage. Put a small amount of accellerator in little bottle or something, and put it as far from the super glue as you can get it on your work surface. And use a separate toothpick for the glue and the accellerator!

And keep a bottle of super glue remover (debonder) nearby for when you glue your finger tips together!!!!

Bob

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 7:14 am 
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FG Cutter
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Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 9:08 am
Posts: 49
Location: Cambridge, England
I don't generally bother with rigging on FG models; it takes too long for my patience to endure!

Method 1: On my Bullet I used Lycra thread. Pre-drill holes and sew in with a needle. The advantage of Lycra is that if you knock or drop the model, the stuff just stretches then returns to its original state.

Try stick and tissue model suppliers for the Lycra thread. It is used on peanut scale models and comes in several thicknesses and colours.

Method 2: The old 1/72nd plastic modeller's method - use old plastic sprue, warm over a candle and stretch it out to the right thickness. Produces rigid lengths of rigging that can be cut to length and glued in place. OK for display but not very durable! I did a 1/72nd Camel once by this method. Looked great but the rigging took a week!

AJD


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 Post subject: Rigging
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 4:15 pm 
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FG Origami Master

Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2005 4:11 pm
Posts: 182
Location: Marion County, Texas
Hey, Adrian, and all the rest of you guys and gals,

I have only one good thing to say about stretched sprue for rigging: when you get a piece securely in place, you can shrink it by holding a lighted cigarette NEAR it. Gives really tight rigging. Generally speaking, I hate to try to use stretched sprue for ANYTHING.

I really like the idea of using Lycra thread. Even more so in seeing how many use it for rigging rubber-band powered flying models and WWI scale models. I found praise for it for rigging all over the www.

But, somebody help me out. I spent half an afternoon googling for Lycra thread, flying model suppies. etc. and never found a source to order from.
The responses I have received from nearby hobby shops and fabric shops has been universally "Huh?. I didn't know they made it." (Of course, I'm in the hinterlands of rural Northeast Texas!)

If any of you know of an online source, please let me know.

:?:

Bob

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 4:21 am 
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FG Cutter
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Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 9:08 am
Posts: 49
Location: Cambridge, England
For Lycra thread try:

www.samsmodels.demon.co.uk

Part code D26

World-wide distribution but they are based in the UK! Sorry!

Regards

AJD


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 Post subject: Lycra thread
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 8:41 pm 
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FG Origami Master

Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2005 4:11 pm
Posts: 182
Location: Marion County, Texas
Hi, Adrian,

I checked out that site and found the whole site interesting, until I figured out how much it would cost to buy a spool of thread from England and have them ship it to Texas! I think I will stick with black Nymo beading thread!

Seeing all the peanut sized flying models kinda make me wish I was somewhere out of the piney woods. The biggest open space around here is about 100 feet square between 50-75' pine trees. Forget free flights!

Thanks for the suggestion though.


Bob

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I'm not an old fool, but I'm taking a correspondence course to become one.


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 Post subject: Rigging Bi Planes
PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2007 2:58 pm 
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FG Tissue Paper

Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2007 2:08 pm
Posts: 1
Some tips on rigging, definately not everything on the subject. Have fun and discover your own.

One method is to locate all of the starting and ending points of the rigging before assembling the model and put small pinholes through the surfaces where the rigging anchors and attach the starting points. Another is to wait and start the rigging once the model is assembled. Most models require a combination of both methods and regardless of when you put the holes in, put them in the direction that the rigging is going. This will become evident the first time your rigging wants to go at a 15 degree angle and your hole through 2 surfaces is going at 90 degrees.

Use authentic resources for accuracy of the placements. You'll like your model better if it actually looks like the real thing and the rigging makes sense.

Monafilament fishing line comes in a variety of weights and it can be colored with markers. You might as well get an assortment as not all rigging on real planes is the same weight. If you like silk line, waxed cotton, or whatever, by all means use it.

Using Thick Cyano ( super glue) attach the starting end of each piece of rigging to one point on the surface of the plane. If multiple rigging attaches to the same point and goes in different directions, then it is best to wait until these can all be attached to the end points so that the rigging can come out of it's attachment point in the right direction. It is possible to have many pieces of rigging coming out of the same hole so things might get complicated.

Yes use accelerator on the cyano if you are in a hurry.

Leave enough excess at the end to provide something to clamp on to for tensioning. ( described later )

If you are attaching to the starting points before assembly roll up the remaining rigging for each attachment point and tape it to the surface of the plane until you have it assembled. Use low tack tape or you might mar the surface of your model when you try to peel off the tape.

Assemble the model using the usual jigs for wing placement. You don't use jigs? No time like the present to start. I won't go into it now there are many sources on the web for tips on making wing jigs, or use your imagination.

Once the wings, gear, tail etc are in place, starting from the inside out, feed the rigging from its starting point to it's ending point through the holes you previously made. Tweezers and hemostats work good for this. If you didnt make holes ahead of time, well you have to do it now but if the place you want to put the hole is between 2 wings in the case of a complicated triplane, you will wish you had put the holes in first.

By using a clothespin, hemostat, or other clamp you can clip the trailing edge of the rigging line and let gravity pull it tight while you put a small dot of cyano where the rigging runs through the surface of the model. Micro droppers and magnifying lenses work great for delicate work.

When multiple wires attach to the same point it is necessary to run all the wires at the same time before gluing. If all the wires are run through a clothes pin whose jaws have been sanded flat, then they can each be tensioned independently if enough excess has been provided for.

If there is danger of warping the model with too much tension, then use a smaller clamp, a paper clip with something small hanging from it might be just enough to get the tension right and not warp the model.

Take an xacto blade and slide it across the surface of the work to trim the excess at the root and you are done. Sometimes a bit of paint is needed for touch up when rigging has gone through a surface.

Rigging is a delicate process which requires some planning and patience, but being able to admire your tight, accurate, microscopic rigging will make it worth the effort.


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 Post subject: rigging
PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 3:50 pm 
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FG Origami Master

Joined: Mon Nov 20, 2006 3:48 pm
Posts: 221
Location: liberty lake, wa
I rigged a ship once, and planes are sooo much easier. I'm a bit more likely to use what line is laying around, and with the ship I used black and grey sewing thread, but hung it from the ceiling in the shop and painted it with water-based polyurethane. the line was straight, didn't frey and easier to make tight-appearing. I don't usually consider my paper models as long -lasting, but this method may work for them too. When I rig biplanes I have been making a small paper square with two holes to glue to the upper wing and regular holes or glue to the strut on lower wing. For me this is about as complex I go with paper, and can glue with white glue.
I'll say this, though a biplane rigged is far neater looking model just like making clear canopies, the planes just look more realistic.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2007 7:45 am 
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FG Origami Master
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Joined: Fri Sep 17, 2004 6:33 am
Posts: 454
Location: San Antonio TX
I use gunmetal gray colored thread for fine cables, and for larger scales gunmetal gray needlepoint thread, all found at Hobby Lobby, Michaels, or Wal Mart. I also use silverish fancy needlepoint thread that's very heavy, unravel and re-wrap it, then get it all gluey and form it into what I want. It ends up looking like chain, which is very useful in displays where aircraft were chained to flight decks, or land-birds chained to grounding loops to prevent them from flying away in inclement weather.

Possibly even as safety chains for GSE, hmmm...

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 Post subject: Biplane Rigging
PostPosted: Sun Aug 05, 2007 9:13 am 
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FG Tissue Paper

Joined: Sat Aug 04, 2007 5:34 pm
Posts: 3
Location: Dayton OH
I punch/drill holes near the tops and bottoms of struts before installing them. Then I use a dental floss threader (instead of a needle) to get the thread through the holes.


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