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 Post subject: Fokker D.VIII assembly question
PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 6:30 am 
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FG Cutter

Joined: Tue Mar 10, 2015 10:36 am
Posts: 58
Location: Pennsylvania, USA
Hi everyone,

It's been a while since I've been able to get back to modeling, as we moved across the state at the end of last year.

I'm in the process of assembling the Fokker D.VIII, and everything seems to be progressing well, except that I don't know how to "close" the wing tips on the model. The wing went together fairly well, but there is a small gap between the curved airfoil on the upper part of the tip, and the flat bottom portion of the wing.

My first thoughts were to actually slice the upper part of the tip and camber it slightly downward to close this gap. As an alternate approach, I though of simply "pinching" the ends closed, but that seems to destroy the appearance of the wingtip.

I'd appreciate any recommendations.

Thanks in advance,
Willie

P.S., If i can remember in which box I packed my camera, I'll post a picture of the wing tips...

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 Post subject: Re: Fokker D.VIII assembly question
PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 7:17 am 
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FG Origami Master
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Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2013 7:45 pm
Posts: 343
Location: Red Bluff, CA
What I usually do on wings (and all things hollow) is make joining tabs at the ends that can folded in to avoid crushing the wings. This can easily be done (if you haven't cut it out yet) by just cutting them like regular tabs at the ends of the wings, like standard fuselage tabs.

Or.... you can make a flat piece smaller that the wing with tabs on it the can be laminated to the inside bottom of the wing and fold the tabs up so the top an bottom edges of the wing do not get crushed. This method also strengthens the wing and cuts down on the warping. There are pictures on my model thead that show what I did.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=4339

Hope this helps,

Beard

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 Post subject: Re: Fokker D.VIII assembly question
PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 12:19 pm 
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FG Cutter

Joined: Tue Mar 10, 2015 10:36 am
Posts: 58
Location: Pennsylvania, USA
Thanks Beard!

I should have posted the question before I assembled the wing.

I'll definitely use the approach you recommend on my next project. I found my camera, so here are some pictures of the patient:

As you can see, the wing went together with the bottom surface entirely flat and reasonable alignment of the leading and trailing edges... the edge-on view shows the resulting gap between the top airfoil shape and the bottom surface.

The bottom view of the wing tip shows a slight overhang, which I thought would fold down and close the gap.

Any ideas other than brute force to close this?

Willie


Attachments:
File comment: Bottom view of wing tip
IMG_0658.JPG
IMG_0658.JPG [ 175.56 KiB | Viewed 2681 times ]
File comment: Edge-on view of wing tip
IMG_0656.JPG
IMG_0656.JPG [ 177.7 KiB | Viewed 2681 times ]
File comment: Top view of wing
IMG_0655.JPG
IMG_0655.JPG [ 223.08 KiB | Viewed 2681 times ]

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Everything should be made as simple as possible... but no simpler!
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 Post subject: Re: Fokker D.VIII assembly question
PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 5:27 pm 
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FG Origami Master
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Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2013 7:45 pm
Posts: 343
Location: Red Bluff, CA
I built a DVIII but I ended up redesigning just about the whole thing. I think the only thing I didn't change was the wing. Anyhoo, when I built it I made the front of the wing curved, so the bottom was curved also. I think mine came out to thick (it is on page 8 of that thread). It also wasn't the best wing I have ever built.

The fuselage on the Fiddlers Green model isn't thick enough, vertically or horizontally, especially at the back. It is very similar to the fuselage on the DRI (may even be the same, just adapted) so it has the curve at the front and it flattens out about the back of the cockpit.

I think the thing that started my repainting and eventual redesigning was the Lozenge Camo, it has those dern black lines around each lozenge which drives me crazy. Also, the wing of the DVIII was plywood so it wasn't fabric covered, so the lozenge on the wing shouldn't even be there, lol. As an aside, they have a full scale diorama of a DVIII crash at the Boeing Museum in Seattle which has the wing and some other stuff screwed up.

You are doing a very nice job on the model as it is designed, and the FG wings almost naturally come out flat on the bottom.

Beard

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 Post subject: Re: Fokker D.VIII assembly question
PostPosted: Fri Mar 17, 2017 2:16 pm 
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FG Folder
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Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2013 3:07 pm
Posts: 79
I have had issues with the wings myself especially on the Fokker DVII. I don't crease or bend too much the front wing (leading edge) at the beginning, just enough to bend over the top wing to meet the bottom wing at the back. That leaves the ends open to check how the top will mate to the bottom. That's when I can check for warpage. I can then adjust the crease to mate all surfaces, but only if nothing has been glued just yet.

I will also glue an internal support for the wing giving it strength from one end to the opposite end. Usually it is made out of balsa. I carve the end that fits up against the leading edge to match the curve of the wings, thus giving the leading edge its' shape

I will start from the middle of the wing (gluing) and work towards the outside. Unfortunately I find I still have an overlap of the top wing over the bottom wing at the end. It is something I can live with though. I glue the ends close, and when dry, I trim off the excess overlap and color the seam.

It's easier for me to do it than explain. My method is probably more confusing than helpful. Sorry for that. This is what works for me after trial and error.

Good Luck!

caddmann05


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 Post subject: Re: Fokker D.VIII assembly question
PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:02 am 
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FG Cutter

Joined: Tue Mar 10, 2015 10:36 am
Posts: 58
Location: Pennsylvania, USA
Thanks for the replies and hints everyone.

I was finally able to close the wing tips without distorting the wing -- I definitely will use your ideas when building my next project.

I had a bit of difficulty in figuring out how to attach the parasol wing and maintain proper alignment. I first attached the "V" cabane struts to the fuselage, and then attached the single forward strut to the fuselage and the upper ends of the "V" cabanes.

I then attached the rear single struts to the wing. After everything dried a bit (but could still be coxed into position), I attached the forward struts to the wing, and the rear struts to the fuselage.

Here is the finished model:


Attachments:
IMG_0661.JPG
IMG_0661.JPG [ 199.33 KiB | Viewed 2652 times ]
IMG_0660.JPG
IMG_0660.JPG [ 209.93 KiB | Viewed 2652 times ]
IMG_0659.JPG
IMG_0659.JPG [ 109.51 KiB | Viewed 2652 times ]

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Everything should be made as simple as possible... but no simpler!
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 Post subject: Re: Fokker D.VIII assembly question
PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2017 7:43 am 
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FG Origami Master
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Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2013 7:45 pm
Posts: 343
Location: Red Bluff, CA
Very nice job, those textures make that a pretty little bird. When attaching wings I always find it helpful to use my other three hands to hold things, lol. I put thin floral wire in all my struts to reinforce them, but you could always paint them with super glue to make them rigid, thought that will make them rough and shiney.

Again, that is a very nice build of the DVIII.

Beard

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 Post subject: Re: Fokker D.VIII assembly question
PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2017 8:01 am 
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FG Cutter

Joined: Tue Mar 10, 2015 10:36 am
Posts: 58
Location: Pennsylvania, USA
Thanks again, Beard!

I learned a few things during this build.

My new printer doesn't feed cardstock properly, so I printed the one-page model on 20 lb printer paper, and then used a spray adhesive to affix it to a 47 lb photo stock paper. I learned that instead of getting something akin to 65 lb cardstock, I had something with the consistency of stiff cardboard.

That made it very difficult to fold properly along score lines, and left a noticeable "white" edge which seems to resist my colored pencils. I probably should have just used a second sheet of 20 lb paper instead of the photo stock. It also seemed to tear the paper fibers on the folded "painted" edge, which gives the appearance of weathering.

The other thing I noticed is a slight "bleeding" of colors when I chose the "best" resolution in my printer set up. It's most noticeable on the fuselage in the area of the "red dragon" (I assume that's what it is, although I could not find this insignia in any of my historical aircraft books to associate it with a particular pilot).

Is there anything you can suggest for achieving the "feel" of 65 lb card stock using sheets of 20 lb printer paper?

Willie

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Everything should be made as simple as possible... but no simpler!
--Albert Einstein


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 Post subject: Re: Fokker D.VIII assembly question
PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2017 8:28 am 
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FG Origami Master
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Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2013 7:45 pm
Posts: 343
Location: Red Bluff, CA
A different printer, lol. I have never had that problem so I'm afraid I can't help you here. If the ink is bleeding, it may be the paper you are using, Ink jet ink shouldn't bleed, what kind of printer are you using.

Beard

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 Post subject: Re: Fokker D.VIII assembly question
PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2017 8:37 am 
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FG Cutter

Joined: Tue Mar 10, 2015 10:36 am
Posts: 58
Location: Pennsylvania, USA
It's an HP ENVY 4502 -- I guess I could try using a coated paper, or reducing the ink density (i.e., going from "Best" to "Normal").

The paper I'm using is GP Standard Multipurpose Paper, 20 lb, 92 brightness (145 whiteness). It supposedly has something called "ColorLock Technology" to produce instant drying, vivid colors, and bolder blacks.

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Everything should be made as simple as possible... but no simpler!
--Albert Einstein


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 Post subject: Re: Fokker D.VIII assembly question
PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 3:44 pm 
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Paper Model Overlord
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Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2012 2:42 pm
Posts: 648
Very nice job of the model Willie. very nice. It came out perfect. Well done just be care leaving on the floor. I hope you don't have cats. Only joking with you Willie. wc


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 Post subject: Re: Fokker D.VIII assembly question
PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 6:06 pm 
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FG Cutter

Joined: Tue Mar 10, 2015 10:36 am
Posts: 58
Location: Pennsylvania, USA
Thanks, Waddy!

Not a cat in sight :D

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Everything should be made as simple as possible... but no simpler!
--Albert Einstein


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